flori_ava_star:~:cursor_blinking: :made-with-estrogen: :verifiedlesbian: (@star)

genai, meta-discussion

I don't think saying that AI has literally no use at all is a useful rhetoric for anything but talking to people you've already convinced.

Look. I get it. Modern day, competitive LLMs are made by stealing intellectual property. They shovel money upwards exclusively and are horrendous for the environment. I am not here to debate any of this.

If you want to convince someone of your viewpoint, you have got to be convincing. With a stranger, you usually only get one shot at them hearing you out, so what you say counts.
At this stage of the AI hype, most individuals have used AI purposefully at least once. And, like it or not, that experience has probably been a positive one for the individual you are discussing with; otherwise, there'd be nothing to discuss. Saying "AI has no use at all and whoever thinks this way is an idiot" goes directly against what they have experienced. Further insisting on that statement will prematurely sever the connection you are trying to build. Your only chance at convincing that individual is then gone. And besides both sides being just a little unhappier than before, nothing will have changed.

And I know that you're likely trying to argue cost/benefit through that statement. The thesis is: Even if AI were an insanely useful tool, it is not possible under capitalism to make it into a tool which can be researched, developed and used responsibly and fairly.

But I do think that we collectively can do a much better job at making these facts visible and digestible to bring more people to the right side. A little compassion and kindness go a long way, and I think that—especially in times as rough as these—it is useful to be reminded that not everyone disagreeing with you is automatically an enemy.

genai, meta-discussion

@star
Yeah, it being bad is the least valid argument IMO! it's pretty mediocre, but like, mediocre can be useful if the alternative is not getting the thing done at all. Saying it's bad feels like cope.

The environmental impact is a better argument, but a lot of people don't care, and it's theoretically fixable too, so pretty flawed, and unlikely to convince anyone.

Plagiarism is a solid argument, but a lot of people just like, don't care about morals, and plagiarism isn't always bad enough to really be a big deal.

The fact that it totally obliterates your mental health and ability to critically think, and replaces it with an unfeeling avatar of evil corporations, now that's the real fuckign problem with this shit.

genai, meta-discussion

Don't use AI. There are many reasons not to. You are better off staying curious and learning independently from the stochastic library run by oligarchs

genai, meta-discussion

@star what i can tell is, telling to not use llm because of the environmental impact and ~~slavery~~ social disaster is completely useless
not because i tried, but because im vegan

genai, meta-discussion

@star i also do not try to argue about it being useless because that is beside the point

there is an all-you-can-eat buffet of reasons why it's horrible and i would rather talk about why it's awful than argue about whether it's useful or not

and ofc, antagonizing someone is the worst way to convince them

genai, meta-discussion

@star

"it is useful to be reminded that not everyone disagreeing with you is automatically an enemy. "

Indeed, disagreements should be kept civil as much as possible (when possible!). In my experience, keeping nice and leading by the example of things to do instead leads to better results. I have passively led more than a few people to vegetarianism or to reducong their meat consumption simply by bringing appetizing food for lunch.

At work, some people on my team reduced their AI usage because I showed them the cool things I did without AI, because the AI itself isn't smart enough to do properly in the first place. Instead they strive to learn more amd polish their skills.

genai, meta-discussion

@star the requirement for massive, disruptive data centers potentially in your own back yard is one of the more unifying anti-AI arguments I’ve seen.

genai, meta-discussion

@star i’m starting to think severing the connection is the point

genai, meta-discussion

@star it feels so much to me like AI companies have seeded a bunch of really bad anti-ai arguments to make that “side” of the debate look unhinged and detached from reality

genai, meta-discussion

@bri7 I don't think that's the case. I think that this problem of hostile discourse is much more widespread, but since genai is a burning issue right now, a lot of discourse naturally surrounds it, which highlights the problem there specifically